And so it continues!

ausfi's photostream on Flickr.

This collection is what you get if you want to change the banner to your own photo. The banner was the first thing I saw when I opened the 'new' Flickr. It gave me a great shock. I cannot remember which photo Flickr had given me (a strange photo) , but I have to laugh when people mention 'the horrible seagulls'. The photo might have been quite nice, but people found it an intruder.

177 pages and over 17 600 replies. A good example:
"Flickr, please go back to the old look. I loved my little start page where I could see the yellow "new activity" sign pop up... like I had a little prize waiting for me on the other side. I LOVED seeing my image activity count go up. I loved my sets on the side panel begging people to take a closer look at my stuff.

The new look is heavy and opressive and makes me NOT want to look at my own images let alone anyone elses. PLEASE give me the option to stay with the old look. I can't stand the new format."

Desolate

Old house, a photo by ausfi on Flickr.

This tree is as desolate as I feel at the moment.
It does not feel good to know that all these close to 16 thousand posts that are mostly negative, will have no effect, we have already been told that nothing will be changed back. They allow this thread so people could come and complain, pour out their heart, hoping people gradually get tired and accept it all.

My heart aches when I have this memory of the former first page, with either larger or smaller photos, showing the last uploads, you could already see several details. It looked so ordered, so tidy.
There we re always some people who wished for a justified view on the photostream but I really thought that would not be possible. Now we can see how bad the idea was.

By the way, to get to the HF, just click on a photo to get to the photo and stop the flow, then you can easily scroll down.

They had put up huge posters on the Times Square to show people's new photostreams, of course they dont want egg on their faces going back from that.

For and against

152 pages written by users, over 15,000 posts. Here is one positive one.

"jasbond007 says: Just want to say something good to the Flickr team. When I first saw the new format I wasn't happy, but now I've been working with it for a few hours I am feeling much better about this. First of all, the justified views on my home page, photostream, sets and favorites work fine and are quite snappy on a MacBook Air with 4GB memory running in Safari. The new Flickr will however test the speed of your hardware and internet connection. If you just get spinning balls - and I do with full-screen view - there may be problems which have nothing to to with Flickr. Perhaps you need new hardware or a faster internet connection. So I have been reading a lot of great comments from people who absolutely love the new Flickr interface. If you haven't I'd suggest you look around. Personally, I don't think it's perfect yet, there are a lot of bugs to be fixed, and there is a huge amount of misinformation, bitching, complaining and trolling going on. Hang in there and keep learning how to use it, it's early days for the new Flickr. Don't think it's going back to the old Flickr, just sayin'." "Lovefordgalaxie says: I have just uploaded my last 200 pictures: All of them black canvas. R.I.P Flickr. Let's everybody upload black canvas, and stop uploading at all untill they change it back to the real Flickr. " This is from a letter from Flickr:" While we will not be reverting back to the prior version of Flickr, we do want to create a positive experience for all of our Flickr members. If you have any constructive feedback regarding recent changes, we would love to hear from you in our forums." "Kyre Wood says: 6. Along with many other people, I used to use the comments section to display pictures as a series or subsidiary images to give background to the main picture. That is no longer possible. 7.I frequently used the "description" section as part of the title. It can still be done, but it no longer has the same visual impact. 8. There used to be a choice of display. I used to arrange it so that the top picture was displayed alongside the relevant set. This is no longer possible." This last one, I used to do,  7. also. Extra photos of the same subject, maybe at different times, maybe different parts of the subjects, that would not be so effective if shown side by side. Now when only some of the comments are shown and you have to click for more, many of the photos do not show, if people are not interested in seeing more comments.

Objections, in vain?

Now it is almost 13,000 posts  and 129 pages. But of course we know that Flickr CEO will not go back on her design, they just let us rave and rant till we get tired. Many have left for Ipernity or other companies but maybe enough people will stay. I would not really like to leave my baby, the Oslo Opera House group. Over 4000 photos. I am not going to pay their  fees, though, ads or not. And I have to learn to live without stats. 1 terabyte is enough. But 3 minute videos! A few of mine are that long.

The END of this account (on Flickr)

The END of this account, a photo by okalbum on Flickr.

Okalbum, I hope you do not mind that I use your photo on the death of Flickr.
Marissa said she looked a lot to mobile when undertaking the new design. Marcus: Photos are important to both older and younger demographing. And the new design greatly simplifies use to appeal to all ages.
T.O question : What changes have you made internally to ensure that Tumblr does turn into a Flickr like acquisition (meaning a failure)?
The gall of them! 117 pages posted now, today going over 12,000 entries, a few of them positive. Yet, many have already left for Ipernity, who are making programs so people can turn all their photos to Ipernity.

Flickr disaster

The post  by Edwinjones on Flickr says it all:
"1. Photostream
Old Flickr - I the user get options on how it is viewed both by myself and others. Either larger or smaller images and I can promote my sets on the first page. New Flickr - I get no options. The header image is unnecessary and takes up too much space above the fold. The resolution required for the profile image has been increased with nobody bothering to tell us first.

2. Individual Images
Old flickr. Clean and simple layout. I can see at a glance the picture and a map if available and the number of views, comments and favs. New flickr the number of comments made cannot be seen without scrolling down. Click needed to see exif assuming this is noticed in the links from the dots to the side of the picture, click needed to see the map. It appears showing the picture on black is not good for sight problems.

3 Viewing Contacts Images, groups and search
Old Flickr. I had a wide choice of viewing these as justified or as various thumbnail sizes. New flickr you restrict me to justified. I have over 500 contacts and comment on many of them. In the old system using a thumbnail size it was much easier to quickly see the photos I wished to view and comment on. In Groups I liked to quickly look though pages and might only look in detail at I picture per page, Justified is totally unsuitable. You just destroyed Groups. For groups and search only the most recent pictures will be viewed. Justified is far too cumbersome especially for those on a slow connection."

Jim Davies said: "Flickr users are photographers.

As a result we are also aesthetes. We know what is "good".

There was always a very, very sweet spot for me with Flickr - lots and lots of easy to find high quality photographs and a chance to share my own attempts with like minded people. These ranged from lo-fi analogue fans to megapixel professionals and all points inbetween. There has been nowhere online to compare.

As I type this there have been over nine thousand replies to this topic in fifteen hours almost overwhelmingly disapproving of the new Flickr.

It is clear that you have made an unpopular choice. I don't think Yahoo! will gain as many new users from the new Flickr as they will lose unhappy ones who feel cheated, dismissed, or just can't stand the idea of a Facebook style cover-photo.

I can find no reason to rejoice in any of this." 

As to me, I had been away from Flickr for some two hours, when I returned I was confronted by a cover photo so I almost thought I had landed on Facebook. No, it was a huge change on Flickr, everything, photostream, sets, groups where in justified view, just scrolling, scrolling, scrolling. When at last I got to an individual photo page, I was promised some info. Most of it was just "see how wonderful we are now". The only real info was what a 'terabyte' is, which free accounts now are promised, 500 000 photos!

It said: 'Pro members, your subscription stays the same.' ??? First, there is no pro anymore, it has even taken from your name. Yet they call you pros! Secondly, the fee is doubled to 50 dollars/year, if you do not want adds. Free accounts get this terabyte but must have adds and do not get stats. 

There is a new category called 'Doublr', 2 terabytes, costing 500 dollars a year. How many do you think will want that?

I have been able to find some features (by trial and error) so it's a bit easier. 

There are six official topics where users can tell about bugs and their feelings. 

Feedback on today’s site changes 

was started 11:20 last night. Now, in the afternoon next day, it has 93 pages, mostly negative, very  few positive expressions. 

My initial reaction was one of horror, I even wept!
The photos are on a wide black background,without a choice, which we had  before.

This was my contribution: "Wow, I did not think I had been away from Flickr's photostream for more than a couple of hours and when I get there I see COVER PHOTO so I thought I'd come to Facebook! I did never think they could do justified on the photostream! though I saw people wish for it earlier, I thought them stupid LOL. 

Is it possible to opt out of it? I thought I saw some. one ask that earlier but I'm too nervous/upset to read posts. Do we get to a photopage by clicking on a photo? I hope I get used to this but for the first time on Flickr I have doubts! 

And the same thing I hated on other justifieds, loading for ever and ever, crazy. 
This is sure to get more people writing on the HF than ever before. I LIKED THE PHOTOSTREAM, BUT NOT THIS! I have hardly ever complained but this is too much, aarrgghhh!
The whole thing is a big bug!! 

You have spoiled the whole Flickr experience, who wants to come here any more! You are welcome to have a justified view for those who have wanted it, but let others have the chance to have the old photo page and thumbnails

I do not feel quite as suicidal as I found the photopage and there is still some familiar things there." 

On my photopage it says: 

Pro members, your subscription remains the same
Later I have found more on FAQ and those who were pros when this change happened, can reapply for the same fee, 24,99.


This because Yahoo had just bought Tumbrl for a huge amount of money. 

17. May, day of children's processions and national costumes.

Untitled, a photo by ausfi on Flickr.

We were lucky again with the 17. May (syttende mai), the constitution day, there were only a few showers of rain in Oslo. Everyone is supposed to dress in their best clothes (pynte seg). To the majority of Norwegians, it means to wear their "bunad", national dress, even many children do that. They are gorgeous, strong colours, beautiful complicated embroidery, expensive silver jewellery, often gold plated. Brooches which are fairly large cost over 2000 kroner, silver belts can be from 6000 to over 8000 kroner. These are for the Hardanger festival bunad, bought from the internett. You can expect to pay at least NOK 30,000 for one adult costume. Bunads are tailor-made.
http://www.solvbutikken.no/bilder/bunader/dame/%C3%B8st-telemark.jpg
Beautiful East-Trøndelag dress has two breast brooches, over 6000 kroner each.

How is it that any time I write something intelligent (maybe just my opinion) in Flickr, no-one comes any more to see the thread?  Like here:

 Member A:  I've been a Flickr member since April 2009.

I regularly chat with another Flickr member (whom I have marked as "Family") via flickr-mail. Tonight I get a "Slow down partner" spam-block while chatting with my friend? 
This is not acceptable. In the past I have often had long conversations with this person and have never encountered this problem. We can chat via regular e-mail, but for goodness sakes, if you wish to enforce a spam-block, can't one at least get some or other warning before you are suddenly cut off. What if I didn't have his regular e-mail address? I would just seem rude.
I 've opened up a help via e-mail case - number Flickr Case 2569456] Re: Other issues but am posting here in the forum in the hopes that a Staff Member might see the problem and offer to help. Please guys. This is not necessary and was clearly not spam. The guy kept on responding, after all. 

Answer by Flickr:  You are indeed hitting our anti-spam limit. You should able to send Flickr mail again in a day or so. 

Member A:   I have been a member since 2009. I have chatted to this guy since 2009. Between us there have been more than 10 000 Flickr- mails on this account alone. He does not consider my flickr-mails spam Do you really want us to go outside of Flickr? Do you want to chase us away? 

Member B:  It could just be that using Flickrmail as a chat program could quickly exceed whatever the spam limit is. If you're actually going back and forth dozens of times in a short time period, then yes it may be better to use a tool that is designed for that a little better. 

Member A:  Yeah.
Clearly, I'm not welcome in Flickr. 

Member B:  I don't see where you get that idea. It's just that not every tool is meant to do everything. FlickrMail is a very simple (and slow) inter-site mail tool. I don't think it was ever designed to do rapid chat/texts with.

Member C: Well like mentioned 
You have no public photos
You have no contacts*
You belong to 3 groups
All the groups you belong to were started by you
All the groups you belong to have only one member.
Sorry but Flickr wasn't designed to support to a non-sharer to the community. It was designed for social interaction in group threads and sharing of images with others. Not your personal one-one chit chat.

Member A:  The bottom line is that I was NOT spamming anyone. I abhor spam. I was NOT doing what they accused me of. Staff came along and could clearly see that what was happening was NOT spam - yet she chose do do nothing.
 Now your way of using Flickr is your business. How I use it, is mine. I used to be very active in many groups - including the Help Forum. I used to admin one of the most active social groups on Flickr but it's nasty little twerps like you who like belittling others who chase people like me away. I am sick and tired of people like you. Your contribution is worthless. I hope it makes you feel better about yourself, but I no longer want any part of it.
For what it is worth, Flickr, to me, used to be a friendly community. I used to "live" here, but I no longer do. More and more it is becoming unfriendly and unwelcoming and while there are some fantastic, wonderful people who contribute here (amongst others,  above), this Help Forum is a prime example of people  liking to put other people down.

Member C:

I was just stating the positive attributes of sharing & communicating.
 Other's and you indicated my vision wasn't the only valid use of flickr.
Fair enough and I accept that. But the need to get nasty & name calling doesn't show much maturity on your part. 
I don't think I said anything nasty or belittling to you.
But then you seem to need to?
”but it's nasty little twerps like you who like belittling others who chase people like me away. I am sick and tired of people like you.Your contribution is worthless.”

Member A: (to a member he appreciates)   I wish you well. If you will permit, I will take a leaf out of your book and say: "Go ahead guys. Tear me to threads, if you like. I won't be back here to see what you are saying. I've said my bit." 

Me: 

You probably are not coming here any more. It is a pity if you go, but I also find it sad to go to an account and be confronted by "nothing available to you" as this is supposed to be a sharing site. Sometimes I feel like having a door closed in my face. But certainly there are various ways to use the site. 
For me, I have not found Flickr unfriendly in general, I have some friendly exhanges even in comments, but for some reason things sometimes get heated in the HF, even when people just try to explain why something is happening. I could not see anybody be abusive to you, it was only you who said some nasty things about another user. 
Naturally you do not see your conversation with your friend 'spamming'. Unfortunately, Flickrmail has been designed for sharing information with others on Flickr, not as a chat feature. Sometimes I do not get anything for weeks. You hit the spamming limit, it was not personal, it is just something designed in Flickr to spare members from real spamming, not a "let us get Koeshke!" How can it be an insult? 
"Is that so wrong?" It is not wrong to want to do that, it just does not suit the rules here. Would you accenpt free spamming here? 

Mount Kilimanjaro, Wikipedia

Warren and climbing

'It is interesting, how many there are, with Warren either for the first or the last name, who are either climbing or otherwise connected with climbing.. There is the amazing Warren MacDonald climbing Mount Kilimanjaro with no legs, but there are many more/

Marlin Integrated Capital Holdings Sponsors Kilimanjaro climb to aid Tibetan charity

Warren Dedrick, Chairman Marlin Holdings, today announced the Marlin Group will sponsor a high profile climb of Mt. Kilimanjaro aimed to raise funds to support sustainable development in the Kham region of Western China. Kham Aid is the designated charity

Warren MacDonald,  amputee to reach the summit of Africa's tallest peak, MtKilimanjaro. ...

chiropractor Timothy Warren    Mount Everest    so far he has climbed three of the world's seven summits - Mount McKinley in Alaska, Mount Kilimanjaro in Tanzania, and Mount Aconcagua in Argentina.

Warren Wolstencroft  Warren lost part of his arm to cancer but doesn't wear a prosthetic limbWarren is trekking up Kilimanjaro for charity in July 2006.

At the same time a filming team from Warren Miller Films under the direction of Chris Patterson was on the mountain with EWP making a documentary on a ski and snowboard descent of Elbrus

Kilimanjaro Ice Core Records: Evidence of Holocene Climate Change ...

The second large event in the Kilimanjaro record began as an abrupt 18O depletion at ~6.5 ka ... AT Grove and A. Warren, Geogr. J. 134, 194 (1968) [ISI]. ...

Warren Storkman - Climber.Org Roster - 12.25

Climb Kala Pattar and/or Ascend to Mt. Everest Base Camp Sep 30 - Oct 21 (Sat-Sat); Mt. Kilimanjaro Climb with optional safari Jan 3-22

Biography for Christopher T. Warren - 11.52

Christopher T. Warren - Filmography, Awards, Biography, Agent, Discussions, ... Summits (Mount Kosciuscko in Australia and MountKilimanjaro in Tanzania

Adventurer Warren Jansen of Jekyll Island returns from his ascent of Mount KilimanjaroAugust 29 - September 6. His

Outside of his practice, Mr. Warren was a soccer coach for several years and remains an avid cyclist and runner, having competed successfully in several duathalons and marathons, including three Calgary Marathons, the 1998 World Endurance Duathalon and six Boston Marathons, the latest one in 2003. In 2004, he and his family huffed and puffed their way to the summit of Mount Kilimanjaro in Tanzania. Kenneth J. Warren

                                                                                                                                                                                                                  , daughter and man standing. with Mt. Kilimanjaro in the background. ... Kilimanjaro. Mary Warren and daughter

CPA runners find faith, hope in Africa

JESSICA HOPP
Tennessean Staff Writer

Standing atop Mt. Kilimanjaro, it is easy to forget what lies below.

Fifteen thousand feet above the arid plains of Tanzania, what little breath the lungs hold can get swept away by splendor and accomplishment.

Paul and Eddy Warren have been there.

The Christ Presbyterian athletes have traveled through the equatorial jungle and along glacier-eroded mountainsides. With the stamina and determination of life-long runners, they scaled Africa?s highest peak. They understand what it means to be on top of the world.

But they have also been below the clouds where breathtaking beauty is replaced by a war-torn and poverty-stricken landscape.

For the Warrens, Africa is not just a place to vacation.

Some people come out on top, no matter what they do. Like our Chief Magistrate JudgeWarren P. Davis, who, among other honors, has received the William McMahon Award from the American Bar Association and the "Man of the Year" award from La Vision, a bilingual newspaper. 
And even when it comes to giving excuses, he tops anything I've ever heard. Last February, when I was recruiting readers for Dr. Seuss' birthday, I called Judge Davis, expecting him to read as usual. (I volunteer to do this so when I write my poem, I know I'll have names that rhyme with something.) 
Anyway, Judge Davis declined because he'd be climbing Mount Kilimanjaro that day. And it wasn't something he'd come up with at the last minute. He'd worked long and hard on this one. 
"Selecting a training regime was difficult," Judge Davis said. "The first Web sites I reviewed contended that Kilimanjaro climbers must be able be to run at least six miles in 48 minutes. With that information, I did the only thing that a prudent AARP member could do. I looked for other Web sites with less rigorous requirements."
He and his wife, Elizabeth Belden, began training in October for their March climb up the world?s highest free-standing mountain, which at 19,340 feet, would be like a dozen Stone Mountains piled on top of each other.

Warren Ferguson and friends will fly to Africa to climb Mr. Kilimanjaro, the tallest freestanding mountain in the world.

Hey, you're only as old as you think and feel. I hike and climb sometimes with folks in their 70s and 80s. One fellow, Warren, organizes hikes up Kilimanjaro, in Nepal, lots of other places, and as tour leader, is right up there at the front of the group, and that's at 83 or 84.

Welcome to the Adventures of

Dr. Tim Warren

CLIMBING TO THE TOP

MOUNT EVEREST

SUMMIT OF ASIA

8,848 METERS (29,028 FEET)*

Aconcagua, normal route, mid-January 1991: All 11 members of our Mountain Travel team summitted. Head guide was Ricardo Torres-Nava; other members were Beth Baker, Sid Bronstein, Dan Bronstein, James Chandler, Tommy Cary, Lowell Hill, Paul Morrow, Wayne Oldenburg, Dan Warren, and yours truly

Toby Warren - Africa & Australia Expert 
Toby was brought up in Kenya and at a young age gained a passion for travelling. After climbing Mt. Kilimanjaro when he was sixteen he went on to help manage a fishing lodge on the shores of Lake Victoria, hitch hike barefoot through sub-Saharan Africa and spent a year working and guiding in Kenya as part of his university degree

.

That's been a passion for the Desais since the mid-1980s, when they decided to walk every day for a year, in order to ascend 19,340-foot Mount Kilimanjaro on the Kenya-Tanzania border. Apparently, this fitness regimen had been avidly pursued by all present -- includingWarren Stockman of Palo Alto, who at 74 was the oldest strider present. The group nailed the 2,800 foot summit of Black Mountain in just two hours and 25 minutes. Then they dropped down the back side, so they could hike back up and add another 500 feet of vertical to the day's total.

Editors note: Yosemite climbing legend Warren Harding passed away Feb 27, 2002. He will be sorely missed

 

Leonard Bernstein and Wiener Philharmoniker

Arkadij Volodos plays Brahms concerto 2

OnThursday, 24th April I heard Arkadij Volodos play the Brahms Piano Concert nr. 2 with the Oslo Philharmonic. He certainly is one of the leading pianists of this decade. After the third call he sat down again and played something quite opposite to the fairly boisterous concerto. Was it Bach, I'm not sure, gentle, fairly slow, but his pianissimos are magical.

We also heard the 5th symphony by Sibelius, my favourite. The director was Saraste. I love the ending by cords. It also has the famous 'swan theme'. You can find the 5th on YouTube by many conductors. I loved the intrepretation of Bernstein, partly perhaps as it is taken from a DVD, not CD, so you can see him. The ending cords are perfect. And the end where he first thanks the orchestra and then puts his folded hands in front of his mouth as if overcome with emotion. 

For most Finns, Sibelius is something you have grown with, that is ingrained in one, ingraved in one's heart. His name is Swedish but his soul has greated music that feels so true to the Finnish soul. Somewhere in his symphonies and other greater works I often hear the wind in the forest. 

It did not come cheaply!

My old tap in the bath must have been as old as the house (built in 1957). The packing went at last  and water was not just dropping, it was running! Of course this happened in the weekend. On Monday I called my plumber and got an appointment in the afternoon.  But I was not going to get off  cheap. No changing parts when it was so old, he had a whole new tap with him, shiny and beautiful. "This is Norwegian made!" I did not have the heart to tell him that I would have preferred Finnish made!
When it came the time to stop the water, the thing would not turn, he had to go to the cellar to turn the water off, and back to turn it on again. That seemed to add another hour in the bill. The new tap cost me 4200 kroner (720 USD, 548 euro)! But it's shiny and beautiful and simple to use.  No matter it took care of about half of my monthly budget. I think it cost more than my stove! (The shower was not part of the deal.)

Altar rail

Altar rail, a photo by ausfi on Flickr.

Now they say that resident found blood around a boat in his yard and it is said that the subject was alive when he was taken to hospital. Now they say : in serious condition. did he shoot himself or some-one else shot him . I hope he is still alive.

Justin Bieber 2012

Justin Bieber 2012, a photo by ausfi on Flickr.

Justin Bieber arrived again to Oslo. He was here last summer and caused a riot or rather the fans did. One concert was arranged at the Opera house square, it was hot and many fans had  had very little to eat or drink so some fainted. This year he travelled straight from the airport to the concert house. There must have been a queue of 20 000 people so the concert was over an hour late before they were all inside the Telenor Arena.
There was even a program in the TV and he was interviewed by Skavlan of the Norwegian TV. You get an idea of a balanced, normal and lively young man. Amazing that so many people dislike him, make fun him etc.

Boston Skyline, from Bunker Hill Monument

Boston Skyline, from Bunker Hill Monument, a photo by City of Boston Archives on Flickr.

The Boston marathon suspect has been captured after the most extensive manhunt in memory. The evidence seems certain of the deed but difficult to understand how he could have done it (with his dead brother) as there had been no indication, friends and people who knew him were puzzled.
I felt terrible for the parents and other relatives who thought he had been framed, he could not have done it, that was natural .
Wonderful that he is now in custody and alive. Maybe we can get answers. Why did they have to kill the young policeman?

Telenor Arena

Untitled, a photo by ausfi on Flickr.

The Finnish National Theatre, Helsinki

The Finnish National Theatre, Helsinki, a photo by ausfi on Flickr.

I belong to a group reading plays aloud together, which is great fun. We do not see the plays beforehand. A few years ago we read Alan Ayckbourn’s ’Body Language’, an outrageously funny play. One of the characters is called Hravic Zyergefoove, an 84 years old surgeon from an unspecified East European country. Ayckborn has created for him a language, which he speaks in the play. The copy of the play provides a translation but I got the idea that in the performance he just speaks the language that is not understood by the audience, though sometimes his assistant provides a translation. A great chance for an actor!

I went to the internet to see more information of the play. Martin Hoyle, Financial Times, 24 May 1990, in Body Language, writes:

"…an octogenarian surgeon from Eastern Europe whose speech seems a cognate of Serbo-Croatian mixed with Czech and Slovak."
,
But David Jeffels, The Stage, 21 June 1990, in Women On The Verge writes:

"Nigel Anthony as the German surgeon of international repute gives a delightfully funny performance, contrasting with the straight-laced Benjamin Cooper, brilliantly played by Geoffrey Whitehead, who runs the high-class medical clinic in the South of England where the play is set."

I am at a loss to understand why he thinks the surgeon is German as the language looks like this:

Lololo! Nit im. Ip gool crack, men. Int klingt ip ribbt shickershack snoop ipper smoot! or
Ert zimter, een fiss shrigger Memmer Hrootpucker woo ten benshtergeel teadle. Oh, een woot vint ipper ribbies.